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I am an instructor in a mid sized town that boasts quite a few dance instructors (all originating from the same dance company/director) and I wanted some advice on building a student base but want to avoid stepping on any toes. Any advice on do's and don'ts?
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Alabama
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Sun, August 30, 2009 - 8:50 PMAdvertise, advertise, advertise. And the company director always did say that she thought it was good for dancers to take from other people. Just throw it out there to the public at large and let the potential students decide. In the end, the students WILL decide based on many factors that cannot be foreseen (ex., teacher personalities, personal schedules, other obligations, etc.).
It would only serve the dancers at large in the end to experience different teachers....trying to force someone to not do something is like that saying from Star Wars from Princess Leia to Darth Vader (I think) something to the effect that "the more one tries to hold with an iron fist the more will slip through the fingers". You being the movie buff can probably correct that quote.
I wouldn't worry too much about it, Roz. Students will ultimately end up where they want to be. And you already have a strong class load and Zuri is doing well. And your advertising is undertaken by Community Services at no cost to you personally--that's a big plus as the Mobile Paper in Mobile County alone has a 30K readership. I learned this when ACE took out an ad.
It is a free market--and as economic principles dictate-- a free market sparks competition so that all players improve and this benefits everyone, so long as it is done in a professional manner. So, why be concerned about stepping on toes when you are putting your services to the public at large? There's no need really.
I hope this helps. I've learned a lot about marketing/advertising from my husband.
Does this make sense?
Wishing you and Zuri the best.
Ziva Diva
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Ethics
Sun, August 30, 2009 - 9:56 PMBe a good representative for your art form. If 'the public' is impressed by what you are doing, then they'll have more interest in classes, workshops, concerts and parties in general and everyone wins... even the people who might think you are stepping on their toes. -
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Re: Ethics
Mon, August 31, 2009 - 12:01 PMsounds like you've got good advice so far- I'll just add that I like to extend an offer of open communication to other area dancers- whether they reciprocate or not is up to them, but showing that you do want to be respectful of the community as a whole can open doors along the way & has led to some great collaborations here. you don't have to get along with everybody, but letting folks know you are going to be professional and approachable is helpful in the long run. I let them know when I have special events & encourage them to let me know what's going on at their studios as well.
I generally get the most long term students from performing in public- lot's of folks respond to general advertising & pop in for a while, but the dedicated dancers who stick with my studio personally generally do so because they like my personal style (heck, i have to talk them into taking workshops with other people every now & again- there's no getting rid of these folks- lol!)
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 7:50 AMI'm wondering what "mid-size town" and "quite a few instructors" means - no reason, just wondering -
I know no one wants to do this but when I started teaching I went OUT of town, about 50 miles, as I didn't want to cause any consternation whatsoever. There was one teacher in my small town who had an ongoing class of about 3 or 4 - with that kind of turnout, I just didn't think it was a good idea to set up shop there.
I wonder if anyone else drives out of town to teach these days? I know that when I finally settled here (with no other bellydancing going on) I was soooo happy to finally drive only half an hour to get to class! What a luxury! -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 10:40 AMHmmm. Make that mid-sized city boasting 7 teachers w/ several using the same format & materials. What are your thoughts on approaching other teacher's student? -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 12:32 PMDon't. Don't "approach" other teacher's students. Build it and they will come...or not. But don't actively recruit other people's students. Advertise and market, yes. Farm, no. -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 12:45 PMI agree. As much as I've wanted to approach the students at the local belly-robics class or any of the other local venues, it's really unethical to do things like that. However, papering the town with fliers, leaving business cards or postcards available anywhere you can, and other means of making your information very available to the public at large isn't unethical in the least. It's just good business.
Also, take the time to think about the service you're trying to provide and market that way. Where are your ideal students likely to go? Where would they hang out? What kinds of clubs or events would they attend? Go to these places and put your heaviest marketing efforts there. Find ways to reach your ideal crowd.
There are so many advantages to marketing your own services rather than preying off another class. You'll have greater potential to find new students who have never thought about taking a belly dance class before, or never knew where to take classes. Students from other classes won't feel pressured to choose between your class and their current instructor. The other local instructors will also be more likely to work with you rather than against you if you're not trying to steal their students away. Having students from another local instructor's class isn't stealing, but deliberately seeking them out and to talk to them about joining your own class can be seen as stealing. It's not going to build a good relationship with the other local instructors, and in the dance community, having a positive working relationship with the other local dancers and instructors really pays off in the end. -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 12:54 PMI would add this little caveat: I would avoid flyering a venue that already has established teachers at it. For instance, a local dancer to my area has been known to put up flyers at the community centers where other teachers have been teaching for years--where she teaches in completely in another part of town, so it's not like the neighborhoods just naturally overlap. I consider that disrespectful. Then again, this same teacher was seen to be tearing down flyers of other teachers at another studio, so this woman isn't all that ethical to begin with. But something to consider. I would never go to someone else's "house" and put up my flyers, even if it were a public community center, UNLESS I was teaching at that same venue or otherwise affiliated with or working in that center or neighborhood. That's just tacky. -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 6:33 AMAgree 110% Shay!
I don't even advertise my classes at my own events! I figure the people (potential future students) see my dancing and see my students dancing, they can decide from that. If someone who takes from another instructor comes to me wanting to take classes, fine, but I NEVER put my information out at other instructors' locations or events. And I get infuriated when other instructors bird-dog my students - say to them at events where my students happen to dance, "oh you should take my class". To me that is so unethical.
I've even taken classes locally with other instructors and one thing I make it a point to do is NEVER mention that I teach. I'm there to learn not to look for students. Geez.
And I recommend other instructors' classes to my students when they ask me about different styles or other classes they might take.
I've even had another instructor that I recommended to one of my students tell this student that she should only take classes from one teacher because otherwise she might get confused!!!!!
While at the same time this particular instructor is emailing the local BD instructor community that you should tell your students about other classes and workshop opportunities and we should all work together.
I do advertise online and by word of mouth, my students bring their friends/acquitances/their bank teller/their hairdresser, etc and my classes stay full so I think that does say something for my teaching skill, advertising skills and my student base, they must enjoy my classes or they wouldn't tell anyone. -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 11:08 AM"I don't even advertise my classes at my own events! I figure the people (potential future students) see my dancing and see my students dancing, they can decide from that. If someone who takes from another instructor comes to me wanting to take classes, fine, but I NEVER put my information out at other instructors' locations or events. And I get infuriated when other instructors bird-dog my students - say to them at events where my students happen to dance, "oh you should take my class". To me that is so unethical."
Another approach to this might be to make sure that all local professionals (performers &/or teachers) have the opportunity to put out flyers- have a table by the door for business cards, flyers & class schedules. performing is a huge opportunity to draw in potential clients, & especially at my *own* events, no way would I pass it up. No need to go around talking up my classes or anything, but the info is there for folks who are interested in classes or hiring a performer, & having everyone's info available levels the field. Just one other option :)
"I've even taken classes locally with other instructors and one thing I make it a point to do is NEVER mention that I teach. I'm there to learn not to look for students. Geez."
Couldn't agree more on that one. If someone specifically asks, I think it's okay to acknowledge that you teach in town, but that's about it.
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 2:57 PM"I don't even advertise my classes at my own events! "
Zafira, why not? You do the work to put it on, you deserve to advertise yourself there. But if that makes you concerned on any level, then make sure there is a flyer table at the event. That is what we do--put a table out where anyone can put their flyers, postcards, and advertisements of all kinds, so it's there for all to benefit. But don't miss the opportunity to reach out through the events you promote! -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Thu, September 3, 2009 - 7:42 AMHI Shay,
I haven't had the need to.
My classes, and I am blessed, have been full and I turn students away because we are full.
So I have this thing about printing even more paper to hand around if it's not needed, LOL.
~Z
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 12:11 PMI definitely agree. If the neighborhoods overlap, then I don't see a huge problem with it. It's also easier if two teachers have very different styles, like tribal and cabaret. For example, my prenatal belly dance class at the local birth center is going to apply to a very different crowd than would be taking the traditional cabaret classes of the other local instructor. Those classes also happen in the same town. I feel less bad about having overlapping advertising because the class is geared towards a very specific market.
It's definitely one thing if you share a neighborhood. Like I said, a tribal teacher and a cabaret teacher advertising where the other teaches isn't necessarily a bad thing. I'd definitely talk to the instructor at that venue before putting up an advertisement though. I would have no problem putting up a flier where another instructor taught a different style in exchange for putting that instructor's flier up where I teach. I would also gladly refer any student wanting to learn cabaret to another local instructor if I knew one that I would feel confident recommending. Having a positive relationship with the other local dancers and instructors really looks good for everyone involved. It looks much more like community and much less like competition.
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 12:37 PMWhile I don't drive out of town, I would if I was in an area that was saturated with instructors, no matter how big or small the town was. If the local classes are only able to get 3-4 students for any class and they're run by good, qualified instructors that I would feel comfortable recommending students to, I would definitely look elsewhere.
In the town I teach in, when I got here there were no instructors I would refer people interested in dance to. On top of that, I was the only tribal style dancer. Now I do still have the fact that I'm the only one who teaches tribal in town, as well as apparently the only tribal dancer I've seen working locally. There is a new local instructor who may be worth referring students to, but I just don't know. I haven't had much opportunity to see her dance and I have no idea what her instruction style is like. I think for this area, I'm really needed because I do provide a quality service when too many of the other local instructors offer belly-robics or a class geared towards looking hot!
However, I'm also thinking about starting up classes significantly out of town, probably a 45 minute to an hour drive away. Why? Because in that area there are no belly dance classes! Would you believe it? I was looking in hopes that I could find something more convenient than an hour and a half away to take classes myself! I figure it's doing the community a good service in providing dance in a place where it wasn't available before, and I'm not trying to compete with other local classes for students. I think it's definitely a wonderful way to build a business. -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 3:26 PMhe- If I drove for an hour out of town, all I'd be teaching would be moose & squirrels... I do wonder what to do when our town of 35k now has 7 local teachers...
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Tue, September 1, 2009 - 4:50 PMThose are all good suggestions to Roz's initial question. Mobile, a few years ago, boasted close to 300K people. I also drive 45 minutes to teach in a neighboring county that has an ATS teacher at the local community center and I have taught there as a "cabaret" teacher since 2001. Presently, she and I are the only teachers in that area. I also teach a small class (or am starting one again) in Mobile as I've acquired my own small studio space.
In our dance group, Baklava, there are four dancers and all of us teach--at this point I offer classes to the public at large in two counties and the others teach private lessons.
I have also recently advertised and plan to start a "Hardcore Bellydance Practice" hour each Saturday which is marketed publicly and on my email listings to any bellydancer in the area who wants to come on a drop in basis which will be devoted strictly to technique and drilling....this is a class I have always wanted to do and now that I have my studio space can do it. In that case, advertising at large or to emails lists is ok as it isn't trying to "take" anyone's students it is merely putting out information.
In a small town with only about 2,500 people I think concerns would be greater, but our city and the neighboring city where I teach, Daphne, is large enough to handle more than a couple instructors. It's all about advertising to the public--as we all know, when one person teaches may not be convenient to a potential student or that student's schedule. Or, a student may decide they prefer teacher A over teacher B. We all know how fickle some students can be (grins!)
It really comes down to being professional about it. But like one post stated--an instructor who markets well outside her area and/or tears down the ads of another instructor--that is definitely unethical.
That sort of behavior IS unethical but generally sharing information and leaving it to potential students to decide is ok I believe. -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 7:44 AMCorrection: the city of Mobile in 2008 was just over 400,000. Not 300,000. The city has grown! lol!
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Thu, September 3, 2009 - 6:23 AMthe only thing about going so far away to teach is to make sure you get pre-registration (advanced payment), and decide your minimum # of students so you don't end up with only a couple of people in class - I recommend a strict refund policy too for the same reason - need to help compensate for your driving time (& gas). -
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Re: Ethics on building your student base
Thu, September 3, 2009 - 8:00 AMI'll have to remember that if I decide to go out of town. I'm thinking about getting more strict about my local classes as well. They may not be a far drive, but it's hard to get anyone to nail down and commit to anything these days, at least around here.
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Building YOUR student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 7:51 AMWhen it comes to deciding where and when to teach, I suggest a thoroughly-thought-out business plan be your guide. If your business plan consists of luring other people's students away from them, then shame on you for lack of imagination and confidence in your own skills. If your plan consists of attracting people who have never danced before because they never saw the style or technique they wanted to learn, now THAT's a business plan that you can build on.
The 'stepping on toes' aspect is a chance for you to develop character. If you back away from what everyone considers to be their territory you'll be teaching on Mars. If you in good conscience feel you have the above-mentioned style and technique that will draw new students into the student population then gird up your loins and go for it. This is a balance you'll be doing the rest of your professional career: what's good for others vs what is good for you vs what is good for all. And as I said before, being a good exponent of your art attracts more students and performance opportunities for all teachers --- not that they are likely to thank you, of course :) -
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Re: Building YOUR student base
Wed, September 2, 2009 - 11:52 AMI love this tribe! All suggestions are great. I do rely on my ability to get out there and prove my worth as an instructor by performance and networking. I've been very satisfied w/ how this pans out and feel comforted that the success was an honest one, I earned it, and it's because of my talent as a dancer and not a talent at just how underhanded and unethical I could be.
The suggestions on public promotions, advertising, etc, have got my brain juices aflowin' though. Thanks so much all for the great advice and moral(e) support. :-)
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